@Dave,

I just watched you video again.  Have you tried pressing the reset button on that EZB, then reapply the client network for your WiFi network.  I’ve had to do this once in the past for my EZB.  I’m sure you also applied the EZB v41/2 firmware.   Just a thought.

Of course still get the new supercaps that Jeremie  posted.

good luck!

Wow, thanks for the help and tips guys! Great information.

@Jeremie, you mention ESR. I compaired the valus of both your's and mine from their datasheet and this is what I found: The ESR of my current AVX supercaps are rated: 140 ESR Max @ 1000 Hz (m) The ESR of the caps you point me to is : 1 ESR Max @ 1000 Hz (m) That's a huge difference if I'm reading this correctly. I'll be ordering the ones you recommend and see if this works.  I appreciate your help and time spent. I know you're a busy guy.

@Merne, Thanks for all the extra effort and advice. The pics really helped. I will follow your advice and get the caps you guys are using. T answer your questions: No power for any device is being routed through the EZB. Everything, sound amps, lights, motors and servos are wired directly to the power source.  WIFI, Both the robots are using the same wifi network. In fact, the new EZB I installed in this second B9 (after I burnt up it's EZB) was pulled from my personal B9. It already had the sound modification done and proven to work. Saved me some time and effort. I'm pretty sure it has the most recent firmware. I'll double check that. I'll have to relearn how to do that though. It's been years since I've done it. LOL.

I was asking a friend of mine who manufactures ventilator power supplies about this issue. Here area a couple of his suggestions I'll include for food for thought. I'd love to hear your thoughts on them:

Quote:

You should not connect super caps line that across the ezb. All caps look like a dead short at t=0. Because they are super caps they will take a VERY long time to charge to 5t Im almost certain your issue is not brownout. It’s noise from another device on your system creating a pulse on the reset line of your ezb.

Quote:

If it were me I’d instantly increase the power supply current. There is one other thing you can add and that is a TVS (Transient Voltage Suppressor). It’s a special kinda surge absorber. I use them in the ventilator power supplies I manufacture and have them in my robot. They will support the DC rail when magnetic fields collapse - this collapse can cause a spike on the power rail the ground AND the supply. They will keep transitive noise off your rail voltages.

So I'm shopping for the supercaps you directed me through the data sheet you linked to. It looks nothing like what you guys are using. The difference I can see is that the one in the datasheet is rated at 5v not 2.5v.

I assume I only need to use one of these and not have to solder two of the 2.7v caps together?

https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/eaton-electronics-division/PB-5R0V105-R/1026757

EDIT: I think I found them. These are 2.5v, 1f Eaton supercapacitors but I don't see that they are Aerogel. What do you think about these?  https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/504-B0810-2R5105-R

I see these are the "B" series you are using. first link in this post that you pointed to is for the "P" series.

Hi Dave,

I would get the caps from your edited post, the Ultracapacitors 1F 2.5V EDLC B SERIES CYL,  2 of them.

They are fast charging and B series.  I don’t think it matters what brand, but that would be a question for Jeremie.  I have never had a problem with the caps I am using currently.

As for the Transient Voltage Suppressor I really don’t have any expertise in this area I believe JeremIm does.  However I will look at the quotes out of curiosity.

Out of curiosity what if you took everything off the EZB like the amp And anything else connected to it. Even the super caps you have currently connected and try booting and see if you hear it connect to Wi-Fi every time.

PS, I am by far no expert in any of this. I am a very novice and been away from it a long time and it has changed since DJ form his new company has.

i’m slowly getting back into it myself and have to redo everything for my Inmoov currently.  And I work at a very slow pace because I have a hard time focusing. LOL.  I’m just giving suggestions that I hope work.

good luck, merne

Edited: I forgot to say if it does connect to the Wi-Fi every time with everything disconnected, then I would first put the amplifier back on and see if it does the same thing. If it does it could be your amplifier.

DJ in the past has had me remove everything and put one thing at a time on to see which one is causing the issue that I was having at the time just food for thought.

@Dave yeah sorry I didn't really look at what series the datasheet was. I more wanted to give you the manufacturer name.

I'm unsure what to think of your friend's advice. I don't see cross-talk noise ever being large enough to jump over and trigger the reset line. I have never seen this in all my career.

So capacitors are used for decoupling (shunting AC noise to ground) and for storage. Capacitors may look like a short at t=0 if they are filtering the first rising edge but that wouldn't affect anything because power is not on yet. Until the power supply is actually on and then short-circuited then bad things will happen but at t=0, who cares, it's as if there is not power applied. On switching power supplies, output stage capacitors are used for storage and to keep the output level steady. I am unsure about the ventilator world but in the robotics world, we are dealing with huge current demands and see brownouts happen very often. It's a common problem especially when using large motors. As mentioned, one solution is to increase the current capacity of your power supply but you could end up with an outrageously expensive and huge power supply to meet the demand. In robotics we are always worried about space, so another solution is to increase the output capacitor storage capacity (as you are doing). Yet another one, is to use battery power.

In my experience TVS diodes are not the answer. I have used them and when they see a transient voltage they sacrifice themselves and no longer work. I really wanted them to work because they sound awesome, but they failed me. In any case, TVS diodes are not the answer in this situation, they are not going to help with brownout conditions as this is a current starvation problem, not a transient voltage (high positive/negative voltage spike) issue.

I don't think that there's any reason to doubt that the supercap method works, because it does, both Merne and the Synthiam inMoov are proof that it does work. I'm not familiar with AVX supercaps and I'm not sure the reason why they wouldn't work for you, maybe Aerogel is the key.

Wow Dave reading that post about burning the Ezb chip, I feel your pain , you must have as many replacement boards and EZb's as I have too!xD

Again, WOW you guys! Thanks.

@Merne, You have some real good points and tips there. Actually if I pull the supercaps off the EZB will boot and connect to the network properly. No matter what is connected to it. When I was first was troubleshooting this issue I actually had everything unplugged and fond no difference in behavior. Running bare and free the EZB booted and connected. As soon as I installed the AVX supercaps it would lock up. I'm going to order the caps I found in my edited text. They seem very similar but are not Aerogel. I'll also keep looking for the Aerogel Jeremie mentions.

@Jeremie, I really appreciate you sharing your knowledge, thoughts and insight. I'm learning a lot on this subject. You have helped me understand a lot of what is going. You also have helped me avoid some missteps. I'm looking forward to getting similar caps like you all have and see the difference. This has actually been a fun process so far.

@robo rad, Well, yes I actually have a lot of extra ezb stuff. However I've ran out of boards. LOL.

I have noticed additional behaviors with the caps I currently am using. If I leave them plugged into the EZB they will drain down to t=0 overnight.  As I mentioned I have nothing pulling power through the EZB. Perhaps the EZB it's self is draining them. #If the EZB is turned on with the caps attached in this state the EZB will lock up. #If I pull the caps The ezb will boot and connect just fine. #If after the ezb boots and connects and I plug in the supercaps in the state of t=0 it will disconnect and shut down. The top green LED will continue to flash but there bill be no lights down near the reset button.

@DJ has mentioned using a switch to connect and disconnect the caps after the ezb boots. I've simulated this. I've so far found that if the caps are or near t=0 the EZB will lock up when the switch is closed and the caps are added to the power rail. I still need to test to see if the caps will shut down the ezb if they are charged when the switch is closed. Perhaps if the caps are isolated from the EZB with an open switch while it's turned off the caps will not drain down to t=0.

OK, I'm still using the original AXV supercaps. I let them fully charge yesterday and shut down the robot. Like mentioned above when power is disconnected the relay opens and the caps are disconnected from the EZB.

This morning I turned on the robot. The relay was still opened and caps disconnected. The EZB booted and connected to my network. ARC was started and connected to the EZB. Next I had ARC close the relay, connecting the caps to the rail. No issues at all! Everything stayed operational and connected.

I think as long as the Super caps don't discharge down to near T=0 then this should work. However I still have the new series B caps coming this Thursday from Mouser. I'll wire them in when they get here and see if there is any change in behavior.